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I thought that was a nice illustration of this as well. And Tania and the Bush Gallery itself, that concept is moving us in different directions.TJ: And then you bring Tania here to UBC Okanagan [for her Masters] AF: What do you think of this, this idea that a certain space of non-conflict has to exist for a time, before a space of conflict can be useful and not harmful— AM: —well, one thing is this friction, friction caused by different opinions, right?

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Tillsammans skapar vi trygga mötesplatser för HBTQIA-personer och lyfter genom bland annat workshops och föreläsningar, förställningar och utställningar, samtal och mötesplatser, fest och allvar.Like an artist coming into academia is not necessarily fully recognized as a scholar, and their work is not necessarily representing scholarly research or things like that. SF: Yeah we talk about that, ‘research-creation,’ because that’s something that’s preserved within the institution, preserved—did I say preserved, I mean reserved—for people inside the institution like academia.You don’t find artists out there in the world, working away, talking about ‘research-creation,’ they talk about their process, but not unless they’re attached to an institution do you start hearing the phrase ‘research-creation.’ I think that’s interesting you know, and when we originally started the Summer Institute that was an area we were trying to capture.So that’s a pretty powerful statement for some people at the Intensive.But we actually didn’t talk about that during the panel session [on land], it was something that came out in dinner conversation.So if you said that to them, that would make perfect sense in terms of a process-based artist’s work that was rooted in customary practice: it’s rooted in research that is familial, it’s communal, it has to do with their relationship with the state, I mean it’s very fraught.

I think that’s one of the things that really marks the aesthetic of Indigenous artists writ large is that that’s part of it.

” AF: But you, Ashok and Stephen [Loft] are peers and have known each other for a long time, and you also have a fairly protected kind of status in a way right?

Tenured professor, or Canada Council, you know you are accorded a certain amount of status or whatever by whatever structures.

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It can be seen as conflictual, or it can be seen as, for example, Stephen and I talk about a certain idea, and we have different takes on it, respecting each other’s position on it, but also saying, ‘you know Steve I think you’re wrong on this’, and that can happen, and it has to.